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If Stage IV becomes resectable

Forums General Melanoma Community If Stage IV becomes resectable

  • Post
    Spl25
    Participant

      I know a lot of people on here have done immuno and had reduction in tumor burden to the point where their tumors are localized to a specific organ. has anyone had a visceral organ resected at this point? what was the outcome? I'm not there at the moment, but hope to be, and would like to be able to have an informed discussion with docs if that point is reached.

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        BrianP
        Participant

          I think it's still tough to make an informed decision in this regard.  The data on immuno therapy is still not developed enough.  I'm assuming you are in a situation where you have a tumor shrinking due to immunotherapy.  Ideally you ride the treatment out until it's gone.  If it reaches a stable state (which is a farily common outcome with responders) and is still causing issues then probably resection is the next step.  If it shrinks and isn't bothering anything then what do you do?  I was in that situation about 18 months ago and about 4 of 6 "experts" told me to let sleeping dogs lie.  I'm not sure if you would get that same response 18 months later.  I personally would lean toward resection if the surgery can be done safely.  The risk is probably going to vary from organ to organ.

            Spl25
            Participant

              Thanks so much for this Brian. My guess is there will still be some disagreement among various oncologists. I'm not really sure on what grounds President Carter had resection + immuno for his liver mets, but that seems like a pretty aggressive approach (especially on an octagenarian!)

              cancersnewnormal
              Participant

                I believe Carter's liver resection was how they diagnosed that his cancer was melanoma. I'm not certain that they knew, prior to the mass removal, that it was melanoma. He had lesions in his brain and liver, but without knowing the lesion pathology, the doctors had to get a diagnosis somehow. 

                I had a large lung mass, a few additional smaller lung lesions, a "suspect" spot on my liver, as well as lesions in the brain. My diagnosis came from a pathology report after having my first brain surgery. Prior to the FDA approved availability of Keytruda, I was on Ipi, which did nothing for me as we watched the largest lung tumor continue to grow. My oncologist managed to get me into a research project involving "odd" BRAF mutations, and I was on MEK for 2 months. We had enough shrinkage in the largest lung lesion, that a surgeon agreed to remove the lower right lobe. I could have continued on the MEK until the tumors either disappeared, or began to grow again… buuuuuuut… not knowing if a surgeon would be willing to do resection on a patient with progression, we opted not to wait it out. By the time I began Keytruda (3 months post thoracic surgery), I had only the "suspect" liver spot on imaging, a couple of new brain mets, and one small lesion in the lower left lung lobe.  A round of gamma, and two Keytruda infusions later… everything was GONE… with the exception of the brain mets, which take some time to completely disappear after being radiated. However, the Keytruda kept any new brain lesions from cropping up, which was extraordinarily unusual, given my ongoing history of 2-4 new mets per month. Surgery can be a difficult decision, but knowing that surgeons are sometimes hesistant to remove lesions when a patient has actively growing metastasis… I wanted anything cut out that could reasonably be removed. How aggressive you (and your team) are, is an intensely personal choice. 

                cancersnewnormal
                Participant

                  I believe Carter's liver resection was how they diagnosed that his cancer was melanoma. I'm not certain that they knew, prior to the mass removal, that it was melanoma. He had lesions in his brain and liver, but without knowing the lesion pathology, the doctors had to get a diagnosis somehow. 

                  I had a large lung mass, a few additional smaller lung lesions, a "suspect" spot on my liver, as well as lesions in the brain. My diagnosis came from a pathology report after having my first brain surgery. Prior to the FDA approved availability of Keytruda, I was on Ipi, which did nothing for me as we watched the largest lung tumor continue to grow. My oncologist managed to get me into a research project involving "odd" BRAF mutations, and I was on MEK for 2 months. We had enough shrinkage in the largest lung lesion, that a surgeon agreed to remove the lower right lobe. I could have continued on the MEK until the tumors either disappeared, or began to grow again… buuuuuuut… not knowing if a surgeon would be willing to do resection on a patient with progression, we opted not to wait it out. By the time I began Keytruda (3 months post thoracic surgery), I had only the "suspect" liver spot on imaging, a couple of new brain mets, and one small lesion in the lower left lung lobe.  A round of gamma, and two Keytruda infusions later… everything was GONE… with the exception of the brain mets, which take some time to completely disappear after being radiated. However, the Keytruda kept any new brain lesions from cropping up, which was extraordinarily unusual, given my ongoing history of 2-4 new mets per month. Surgery can be a difficult decision, but knowing that surgeons are sometimes hesistant to remove lesions when a patient has actively growing metastasis… I wanted anything cut out that could reasonably be removed. How aggressive you (and your team) are, is an intensely personal choice. 

                  cancersnewnormal
                  Participant

                    I believe Carter's liver resection was how they diagnosed that his cancer was melanoma. I'm not certain that they knew, prior to the mass removal, that it was melanoma. He had lesions in his brain and liver, but without knowing the lesion pathology, the doctors had to get a diagnosis somehow. 

                    I had a large lung mass, a few additional smaller lung lesions, a "suspect" spot on my liver, as well as lesions in the brain. My diagnosis came from a pathology report after having my first brain surgery. Prior to the FDA approved availability of Keytruda, I was on Ipi, which did nothing for me as we watched the largest lung tumor continue to grow. My oncologist managed to get me into a research project involving "odd" BRAF mutations, and I was on MEK for 2 months. We had enough shrinkage in the largest lung lesion, that a surgeon agreed to remove the lower right lobe. I could have continued on the MEK until the tumors either disappeared, or began to grow again… buuuuuuut… not knowing if a surgeon would be willing to do resection on a patient with progression, we opted not to wait it out. By the time I began Keytruda (3 months post thoracic surgery), I had only the "suspect" liver spot on imaging, a couple of new brain mets, and one small lesion in the lower left lung lobe.  A round of gamma, and two Keytruda infusions later… everything was GONE… with the exception of the brain mets, which take some time to completely disappear after being radiated. However, the Keytruda kept any new brain lesions from cropping up, which was extraordinarily unusual, given my ongoing history of 2-4 new mets per month. Surgery can be a difficult decision, but knowing that surgeons are sometimes hesistant to remove lesions when a patient has actively growing metastasis… I wanted anything cut out that could reasonably be removed. How aggressive you (and your team) are, is an intensely personal choice. 

                    Spl25
                    Participant

                      Thanks so much for this Brian. My guess is there will still be some disagreement among various oncologists. I'm not really sure on what grounds President Carter had resection + immuno for his liver mets, but that seems like a pretty aggressive approach (especially on an octagenarian!)

                      Spl25
                      Participant

                        Thanks so much for this Brian. My guess is there will still be some disagreement among various oncologists. I'm not really sure on what grounds President Carter had resection + immuno for his liver mets, but that seems like a pretty aggressive approach (especially on an octagenarian!)

                      BrianP
                      Participant

                        I think it's still tough to make an informed decision in this regard.  The data on immuno therapy is still not developed enough.  I'm assuming you are in a situation where you have a tumor shrinking due to immunotherapy.  Ideally you ride the treatment out until it's gone.  If it reaches a stable state (which is a farily common outcome with responders) and is still causing issues then probably resection is the next step.  If it shrinks and isn't bothering anything then what do you do?  I was in that situation about 18 months ago and about 4 of 6 "experts" told me to let sleeping dogs lie.  I'm not sure if you would get that same response 18 months later.  I personally would lean toward resection if the surgery can be done safely.  The risk is probably going to vary from organ to organ.

                        BrianP
                        Participant

                          I think it's still tough to make an informed decision in this regard.  The data on immuno therapy is still not developed enough.  I'm assuming you are in a situation where you have a tumor shrinking due to immunotherapy.  Ideally you ride the treatment out until it's gone.  If it reaches a stable state (which is a farily common outcome with responders) and is still causing issues then probably resection is the next step.  If it shrinks and isn't bothering anything then what do you do?  I was in that situation about 18 months ago and about 4 of 6 "experts" told me to let sleeping dogs lie.  I'm not sure if you would get that same response 18 months later.  I personally would lean toward resection if the surgery can be done safely.  The risk is probably going to vary from organ to organ.

                          Polymath
                          Participant

                            Hello Spl25,

                            Short version…I just had my entire spleen removed because it was totally engulfed, and very enlarged, making it susceptible to rupture, among other things.  This after two and half years of various immunotherapy treatments including the final year which was ipi/nivo combo with radiation on other tumors.  Smaller tumors did respond, but the splenic tumors were just too big.  A person can live without a spleen and I'm 5 weeks out from surgery and doing great.  Obviously not every organ is resectable, but it some cases surgery and/or radiation is the only way to treat tumors that are not responding to any drug therapy.

                            Gary

                            Polymath
                            Participant

                              Hello Spl25,

                              Short version…I just had my entire spleen removed because it was totally engulfed, and very enlarged, making it susceptible to rupture, among other things.  This after two and half years of various immunotherapy treatments including the final year which was ipi/nivo combo with radiation on other tumors.  Smaller tumors did respond, but the splenic tumors were just too big.  A person can live without a spleen and I'm 5 weeks out from surgery and doing great.  Obviously not every organ is resectable, but it some cases surgery and/or radiation is the only way to treat tumors that are not responding to any drug therapy.

                              Gary

                              Polymath
                              Participant

                                Hello Spl25,

                                Short version…I just had my entire spleen removed because it was totally engulfed, and very enlarged, making it susceptible to rupture, among other things.  This after two and half years of various immunotherapy treatments including the final year which was ipi/nivo combo with radiation on other tumors.  Smaller tumors did respond, but the splenic tumors were just too big.  A person can live without a spleen and I'm 5 weeks out from surgery and doing great.  Obviously not every organ is resectable, but it some cases surgery and/or radiation is the only way to treat tumors that are not responding to any drug therapy.

                                Gary

                                Kim K
                                Participant

                                  You can look up articles on the role of surgery after treatement with curative intent.  Yes, there is hope for a prolonged remission when using surgery to clean up the last bits.  Usually you are not in a trial because trials want something to follow.  There is a survival benefit.

                                  Kim K
                                  Participant

                                    You can look up articles on the role of surgery after treatement with curative intent.  Yes, there is hope for a prolonged remission when using surgery to clean up the last bits.  Usually you are not in a trial because trials want something to follow.  There is a survival benefit.

                                    Kim K
                                    Participant

                                      You can look up articles on the role of surgery after treatement with curative intent.  Yes, there is hope for a prolonged remission when using surgery to clean up the last bits.  Usually you are not in a trial because trials want something to follow.  There is a survival benefit.

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